charchri4

Hey I forgot about this thread. Great to see you back Gunpilot!

I just ordered my parts this week too. Not that I can do anything with them with it 15 below and buried in snow but whatever.

jreid1000

I took a look at FM & V8-R big brake kits, and none of them seem to
mention a larger master cylinder. Any opinions?

Lateralgeez

Saw a write up where someone put Nissan Sentra SE-R spec V Brembo calipers with Mini Cooper disks on an NB. Only fab needed was caliper bracket. Can't find it now and it's annoying.

**EDIT**

Apparently they didn't do a good job - http://www.miataturbo.net/general-mi...3/#post1178300

"Quick Rant about braking systems and Journalists..
a few months ago jalopnik posted an article about upgrading a miata to sentra brembos. I was pulling my F*%king hair out when they did this. rule 1 the didn't center the rotors. They are going to blow threw wheel bearings. rule 2 they didn't even look at the piston area of the calipers. the sentra has a 38x42mm piston Dim. that equals out to 3.9in^2 of caliper area. A factory miata has 3.17in^2. sure that doesn't sound like allot. until you realise it's 23% larger. that combined with the larger rotors you'll have 25-30% more Brake torque on a chassis that has over weighted front brake bias. This is Stupid, Dangerous, and incredibly irresponsible. the thing that pisses me off about jalopnik journalists is that they really don't give a ****, if the do care they are f&$King retarded. all they want to do is throw some words onto a blog and to-hell with people that die following their advice. They have taken the idea of let's spend money to make this worse, to an extreme. But hell, now it says brembo.. "

MRM331

I just did an upgrade of mine with the same goals in mind. I haven't had a chance to get on it yet as my differential (another big upgrade) still needs adjustment but here are the current specs:

NEW-Master: 1" from a 1992 Mazda 929
NEW-Booster: 1992 Mazda 929
Prop valve: adjustable Wilwood
NEW-ABS pump: removed and bypassed
Front calipers: Wilwood 4 piston
Front rotors: 1991 VW Corrado
NEW-Rear calipers: 2003 Mazda Miata "sport"
NEW-Rear rotors: 2003 Mazda Miata "sport"

With the exception bending the upper brake pedal stop up a bit to keep the brakes from dragging all the new stuff was 100% bolt up.

-Jason

Lateralgeez

Can you get the Wilwood bracket without buying their bbk?

mazdaspeedmiata

Here

Wilwood 4 piston rear brakes? - Page 2 - Miata Turbo Forum - Turbo Kitten is watching you test compression.


Edit: I can't find a set of sentra brembos anywhere. I think it's probably easier / cheaper getting some 300zx brakes

charchri4

That thread is ^ pretty much all vendor hype but post 86 makes it worth a look. Thanks for posting that!

MRM331

I got them five years ago from Trackspeed. The price was not bad at $200 for a set of hangers and rotor centering rings. They no longer list them but I wonder if they could make them if asked.
I was able to pick up calipers new for $125 at summit and rotors from Rockauto for under $30 each. I pieced together my own braided lines using -3an hoses and fittings again from Summit. They came to $14 each.
While the VW rotors are heavier than the two piece options I like being able to replace them for under $30.

I had a chance to play with the prop valve setting today. Three turns from full stops the car so quickly that your face feels like its about to fall off.

-Jason

Lateralgeez

Car-part.com had some but expensive, hard to beat Wilwood at $125 ea. Just have to figure out the bracket situation.

No way.. I was looking at a guy's 300zx brakes (noticed they were 4 piston) but assumed they probably wouldn't work. Must research this.

charchri4

What's the zx rotor thickness and back spacing?

Lateralgeez

Here's what i found... Keith from Flyin Miata Nissan 4 pot calipers on Miata? - MX-5 Miata Forum Post #13
(Someone says only compare surface area of 2 pistons to oem miata piston)

"You could probably use any caliper you wanted on a Miata, it's not rocket science. Heck, Baer uses calipers originally designed for the 'Vette.

You'll have to do some math. The pistons in a four-piston setup are going to be smaller than the single piston in a standard Miata caliper. Work out the surface area of all four pistons and compare it to the surface area of the single piston. If there's a radical difference you'll have to look into other changes in the hydraulic system. This is where a lot of people get things wrong, including those Corvette parts mentioned earlier.

Make sure you have some rotors of the appropriate thickness for the caliper. This should be easy enough to do even if you have to mix and match between existing rotor hats and off-the-shelf rotors. I've also seen Mustang GT rotors redrilled and shaved down but that's the hard way to go.

Make a bracket that positions the caliper correctly. Harder than it looks as it has to be fairly precise but it's not a complex part.

Figure out your brake lines. Most hydraulic shops can build them for you.

Now see what wheels will fit over

So it's not all that hard. The biggest question is - why are you using X caliper? Does it have a good selection of pads? Is it light? Do you have a free set?"

Keith
Flyin' Miata

Lateralgeez

CHASSIS YEAR MODEL FRONT REAR ADDITIONAL
300zx
84-86 Z31 250x20mm 258x9mm NA
84-85 Z31 274x20mm 290x9mm all models
86 Z31 274x20mm 290x9mm NA
84-86 Z31 274x20mm 290x9mm turbo
87-89 Z31 274x20mm 290x18mm NA
87-89 Z31 280x24mm 282x18mm turbo
90 Z32 280x26mm 297x18mm aluminum
91-92.5 Z32 280x30mm 297x18mm aluminum
92.5-96 Z32 280x30mm 297x18mm iron

Sentra
2003-on B15 v-spec 305mm 277mm Brembo

from Ultimate rotor thread!! - S-Chassis.com

charchri4

You are missing a key measurement. Some call it offset some call it back spacing but it's the distance from the inside mounting surface to the inside breaking surface. The bigger the number the closer the rotor will be to the spindle.

The height on my 96 is 45mm so I used a 2000 corvette rotor that is 325 x 32 with a 45mm height but you have to watch height because the vette rotor is 3mm thicker than the Miata one so that means the back space is 3mm less. For me that was intended because that put the caliper was in the right plane to bolt straight to the spindle.

Lateralgeez

Sounds like you have the ideal set up for those of us who need more than the sport swap. I've asked Wilwood if they sell caliper brackets separately.

I did find a universal caliper bracket by Wilwood:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/wi...-N3RoCvrfw_wcB

Lateralgeez

The original post was removed from opposite lock (see post 72, thanks Be Good)


Diesel Driver | Power For Pennies: How To Stop On A Dime

ordonez1307

Bumping an old thread because I'm doing some research and need some clarity from all of you experts.

I currently have 1.6L brakes and obviously need to upgrade.

I'm in the process of building my V8 Miata and am currently doing my research on brakes. I want to be as budget conscious as possible, but will spend money where necessary (I think we're all in that boat).

I *THINK* I have the rears figured out. The fronts are still confusing me. Please let me know your thoughts:

Rears:
2004 Sport Calipers/Brackets $140.00
Rockauto (A-1 CARDONE 19B2812 and 19B813)

10.9" Sport Rotors $34.00
Rockauto (CENTRIC 12145062)

Hawk Blue Pads $116.00
Hawk BLUE Miata Brake Pad Set Rear SPORT for Miata 2003-2005

Stainless Brake Lines (Rear) $63.00
Stainless braided rear brake lines Miata
Rear Total: $353 + I will get some of that back (Probably $80.00) in core-charges.

Fronts:
Willwood Dynalite 4-Pots $248.00
Black Wilwood Calipers FOUR piston Dynalite for Miata

Wilwood Dynalite Brackets?

1991 VW Corrado Rotors (280mm) $48.00 Centric Parts 121-33022 - Free Shipping on Orders Over $99 at Summit Racing

Hawk Blue Pads $122.00
Hawk Blue Brake Pad Set, - FRONT for Miata 1994-2002

Stainless Braided Lines (Front) $47.00 Stainless braided brake lines Miata - Wilwood

MRM331

Hi Corey,

I saw this pop up on my phone and wanted to get a response up before you start placing orders. I did this upgrade to mine and have the part numbers you'll need. Here's some corrections that can save you a few bucks and get you the right parts:

For the rears you have the right idea but your part numbers are for front calipers. The parts you need at the best price I've found are:

Right: Cardone 19-B2739 $108.79 ($60 core)

Left: Cardone 19-B2738 $111.79 ($60 core)



You can tell the sport calipers from the non-sport by the RX7 like ridges they have. No other Miata caliper has this.

Rotors: Raybestos 980314 $30.79



These ones are a few bucks cheaper and have the cool e-coating on the front. I'd still spray them with some BBQ paint on the backs to keep them from rusting to the hubs.

The back only brake line set is cool. you can make up the fronts with components from Summit but the distribution block on the passenger side rear makes it a pain to make up.

Summit and Jegs both have the same price for the 4-piston calipers and free shipping. You're not going to do any better there.

The Front 1991 Corrado rotors can be had for much cheaper. The best price is at Rock for Pronto branded ones:

Pronto BR3482 $16.64



I used these last and they were fine. No one offers the rotors with e coating so just buy the cheapest.

If you go with the Wilwood Calipers you need to get pads designed for them. The awesome part is these pads are about half the price of Miata specific pads. The Hawk blue pads for Wilwood calipers are HB542E.600, $88.94 from Summit.

Your source for front lines is fine. I used universal -3AN lines and found the correct end connections for them. This saved a few bucks over the kit you showed but not enough to go back and do it again.

I got my hangers (and Corrado rotor centering rings) from TrackSpeed engineering about 6 years ago. I'm not sure they still sell it. When I purchased it I paid $200 for the two brackets and the rings. I would give them a call and see if they have any around still of could make you a set up. If they can't you may be able to make a few measurements and have a machine shop make you something in steel.

Now just a few thoughts on what you're planning. First, unless you are planning on only aggressively tracking the car I would not go with Hawk blues. When cold they are so abrasive that when I did use them I wouldn't put them on until I actually got to the track. I actually went down a step at the track an use Hawk blacks. On the street Hawk HPS pads are very good. The numbers you would need are:

Wilwood: HB100F-480 ($64.38)
Rear 2003 Sport Miata: HB442F.496 ($64.67)

If you can't get the Wilwoods to happen (hanger issues) and you're building a street Miata the front sport calipers/rotors/pads would be fine. They may actually be ok for the track as well. The only reason I went with the Wilwoods was that 6 years ago sport parts were still VERY expensive and I could get hangers for the Wilwoods. Today I'd probably just do the sport stuff. The front caliper/hangers you would need are teh ones you have listed above.

Rotors: Rebestos 980315 ($32.79)



Pads:
Blue: HB431E.606 ($129.22)
HPS: HB431F.606 ($92.52)

BTW, if you are tracking and like the Hawk Blacks they are not available for some reason for the .496 rear sport pad. I'm planning on moving to a HT-10 compound as I've been told that's a more modern version of the blacks. Again, I would not recommend the blues unless you are a VERY aggressive track driver.

I hope that helps,

-Jason

charchri4

+1 to no blues on the street! They need heat to work and you would be much better off with HPS.

ordonez1307

Wow. I can't thank you enough for setting me straight on this. That was a really thorough response.

I've got everything straightened out now with the exception of the front calipers/brackets. I sent an email to TrackSpeed Engineering to see if they can send the Wilwood Brackets and Corrado Rotor Centering Rings. I'll post up with their response.

MRM331

No Problem. I don't fool around with brakes. I also didn't want to see you order a bunch of stuff that you'd have to send back. If someone else has figured this out there's no reason for anyone to play the "buy it and see if it fits" game.

If Trackspeed does still make them it makes the Corrado rotors/Willwoods a great option. If not I'd stick with the sport.

-Jason

ordonez1307

That was going to be my next question to you after some more research. The car will be in the 400 hp range, and I really just want to be sure that it will be safe(ish).

Do you think sport brakes will be enough if (when) the car is tracked a few times a year?

be good

guy, stop. I work in professional Motorsports. I build braking systems. the stuff that I've see in here is down right dangerous. that journalist author Bozi Tatarevic built a braking system that can kill people. that's why it was removed.

papabear

So I have read through this thread several time. Because brakes are on my to do list. So for matched brake kits we have stock Miata Sport upgrade, or Wilwood calipers in various kits from Flyin Miata, v8 Roadsters and 949 Racing. I have been searching this evening and that's about all I can find for the Miata platform. I would have though with the popularity of the Miata there would be more options. So am I correct in my thinking that Wilwood is our only real kit option? I would have thought Baer or Stoptech would have a kit but not that I can find.

be good

what i race on and other have found to work well are the 11.75" front rotor kits. V8 roadsters sells it. PFC 01 race pads.

rear doesn't need that much rotor due to our weight bias. i run the Good win racing rear- sport rotor with the 1.8l brake offset. and pfc 11 rear racing compound.

Front
Front Big Brake Kit - V8 Roadsters
this kit

Search results for: '7752.01'
these pads

rear

https://www.flyinmiata.com/1-8-11-re...e-upgrade.html
Good win sells a kit too that comes with 2 piece DBA rotors. i have that kit and the life is very good.

Performance Friction 0636.11.13.44 Racing Pad - 11 Compound
these pads

papabear

So you don't think there is a need to upgrade the rear caliper from the factory sport size? I know it would reduce unsprung weight and I would think a aluminum caliper would dissipate heat better than the iron.